Scanning tutorial video from CCP

Posted on 2009-12-18 by Ecliptic Rift

CCP released a new scanning tutorial video. Apart from the fact that I love StevieSG’s voice, a few things about the video startled me. I had always understood that signatures need four probes on the hit to get a warpable result, and that tetrahedrons provided the optimal geometry due to the penalty for acute angles. I will give this a try, though, just to see.

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  • http://myrhial.blogspot.com/ Myrhial Arkenath

    She does have a lovely voice. I’ve recently found out stacking more than four probes does in fact not give any additional strength, but needing just three is new to me as well.

  • http://myrhial.blogspot.com Myrhial Arkenath

    She does have a lovely voice. I’ve recently found out stacking more than four probes does in fact not give any additional strength, but needing just three is new to me as well.

  • http://twitter.com/bel_amar Bel Amar

    I don’t care if that’s CCP released or not, it’s simply wrong. You /can not/ lock down a signature with 3 probes. 3 probes will give you two duplicate dots, and even if you get them to 100% each, you can not warp to them. You need to remove the duplicate.

    Secondly, the method of using 5 probes is the easy way of positioning them, but it is /not/ the most effective way of maximising probe strength. If the angle between two probes and the signature is less than 90 degree, you get reduced signal strength. Sitting a probe directly on top of a signature is a good way of almost guaranteeing that you get an angle of less than 90 degrees.

    Also, the method of “picking a duplicate” and guessing is not the most efficient way of doing things, because if you get it wrong, you can lose the entire signature. If all of your probes are on one plane, when you get a duplicate, they’re always above and below the plane you’re scanning on. You move the center of your scanning area to cover both of them, make sure you’ve got enough height to get them both, and bang, you narrow it down to a single dot…

    Maybe I should take solace in the fact that as long as CCP is not giving people the optimal way of doing things, there will be less competition for that really good stuff :)

  • http://twitter.com/bel_amar Bel Amar

    I don’t care if that’s CCP released or not, it’s simply wrong. You /can not/ lock down a signature with 3 probes. 3 probes will give you two duplicate dots, and even if you get them to 100% each, you can not warp to them. You need to remove the duplicate.

    Secondly, the method of using 5 probes is the easy way of positioning them, but it is /not/ the most effective way of maximising probe strength. If the angle between two probes and the signature is less than 90 degree, you get reduced signal strength. Sitting a probe directly on top of a signature is a good way of almost guaranteeing that you get an angle of less than 90 degrees.

    Also, the method of “picking a duplicate” and guessing is not the most efficient way of doing things, because if you get it wrong, you can lose the entire signature. If all of your probes are on one plane, when you get a duplicate, they’re always above and below the plane you’re scanning on. You move the center of your scanning area to cover both of them, make sure you’ve got enough height to get them both, and bang, you narrow it down to a single dot…

    Maybe I should take solace in the fact that as long as CCP is not giving people the optimal way of doing things, there will be less competition for that really good stuff :)

  • http://rift.chromebits.net/ Casiella Truza

    Agreed, I raised those issues (though with a less cogent explanation than yours) in the thread. Somehow I think the community staff put that together without input from the game design folks…

  • http://rift.chromebits.net Casiella Truza

    Agreed, I raised those issues (though with a less cogent explanation than yours) in the thread. Somehow I think the community staff put that together without input from the game design folks…

  • http://www.rblprd.net/ John aka. Rblprd

    Ya know, never thought about using a 5th as the center for scanning, guess I fail at thinking outside my box HI HI

  • http://www.rblprd.net John aka. Rblprd

    Ya know, never thought about using a 5th as the center for scanning, guess I fail at thinking outside my box HI HI

  • http://twitter.com/Mannginger Mannginger

    This is almost perfect timing as I’ve just started trying out scanning with a new alt to see what the possibilities hold. Good stuff!

  • http://twitter.com/Mannginger Mannginger

    This is almost perfect timing as I’ve just started trying out scanning with a new alt to see what the possibilities hold. Good stuff!

  • http://twitter.com/bel_amar Bel Amar

    John, don’t start using 5 probes. Following this tutorial is the equivalent of learning to drive in an automatic, yes, technically it works, but it’s taking the easy way out and setting you up to un-learn habits later on

  • http://twitter.com/bel_amar Bel Amar

    John, don’t start using 5 probes. Following this tutorial is the equivalent of learning to drive in an automatic, yes, technically it works, but it’s taking the easy way out and setting you up to un-learn habits later on

  • http://handsoff.myloots.com/ Cyberin

    First off…Bel…yes, you can do it with 3 probes, as I have done it before.

    Secondly, everyone should be using at least 5 probes…it’s much easier (I myself use 7, but those are secret ninja tricks and I won’t mention them :D lol)

  • http://handsoff.myloots.com Cyberin

    First off…Bel…yes, you can do it with 3 probes, as I have done it before.

    Secondly, everyone should be using at least 5 probes…it’s much easier (I myself use 7, but those are secret ninja tricks and I won’t mention them :D lol)

  • http://twitter.com/bel_amar Bel Amar

    You can’t use 3, I even went and double checked to make sure before posting. When you use 3 probes and would be getting a 100% hit otherwise, the game gives you two identical 50% hits, neither of which you can warp to.

    When the new scanning system was first released, you could get 100% hits with 3 probes, but even then, you couldn’t warp to a duplicate hit. Think of the potential abuse of being able to make deep safes easily, by deliberately placing 3 probes over a signature with your 256AU deep space probe…

    The only thing you can get with 3 probes, is an anomaly, but then you only need one 1 probe for that.

    And using 5 active probes on one signature will absolutely never result in the optimal positioning to ensure you aren’t losing signal strength. For scanning out Battleships running missions and the like, speed is probably more useful than optimal placement. If you’re low skilled however, or flying a ship with no bonuses, some of the harder null and low sec stuff can’t be found without optimal probe placement…

  • http://twitter.com/bel_amar Bel Amar

    You can’t use 3, I even went and double checked to make sure before posting. When you use 3 probes and would be getting a 100% hit otherwise, the game gives you two identical 50% hits, neither of which you can warp to.

    When the new scanning system was first released, you could get 100% hits with 3 probes, but even then, you couldn’t warp to a duplicate hit. Think of the potential abuse of being able to make deep safes easily, by deliberately placing 3 probes over a signature with your 256AU deep space probe…

    The only thing you can get with 3 probes, is an anomaly, but then you only need one 1 probe for that.

    And using 5 active probes on one signature will absolutely never result in the optimal positioning to ensure you aren’t losing signal strength. For scanning out Battleships running missions and the like, speed is probably more useful than optimal placement. If you’re low skilled however, or flying a ship with no bonuses, some of the harder null and low sec stuff can’t be found without optimal probe placement…

  • http://handsoff.myloots.com/ Cyberin

    You CAN find them with three probes. You can get a 100% hit with 1 probe if you get lucky and put the probe right next to what you are looking for.

    Is it easy? No…does it take entirely too long when you could simple use 4 probes? Yes…but it CAN be done.

  • http://handsoff.myloots.com Cyberin

    You CAN find them with three probes. You can get a 100% hit with 1 probe if you get lucky and put the probe right next to what you are looking for.

    Is it easy? No…does it take entirely too long when you could simple use 4 probes? Yes…but it CAN be done.

  • http://twitter.com/bel_amar Bel Amar

    You can’t find them with 3 probes. This is very easily identified by jumping in to the game, scanning down a site to 90% or so signal strength so you know where it is, then playing around with less than 4 probes. With a single probe, even the easiest of sites will not go above 99.9 signal strength, even if you place the probe /in/ the site.

    With 3 probes, the results will not go above 50%. Try it.

    It didn’t always work like this. You /used/ to be able to get 100% hits on sites with a single probe or with 3 probes, but even then, it didn’t mean a warpable hit. 100% strength just means that you have no deviation at all. Signal strength of 100% and a hit with 4 probes are the two elements you need to warp. One or the other will not result in you getting a warpin. And even if you disagree with this point (which neither of us can now prove), if you try it under the current system, you’ll see it’s moot, as you simply can not reach 100% signal strength with less than 4 probes

  • http://twitter.com/bel_amar Bel Amar

    You can’t find them with 3 probes. This is very easily identified by jumping in to the game, scanning down a site to 90% or so signal strength so you know where it is, then playing around with less than 4 probes. With a single probe, even the easiest of sites will not go above 99.9 signal strength, even if you place the probe /in/ the site.

    With 3 probes, the results will not go above 50%. Try it.

    It didn’t always work like this. You /used/ to be able to get 100% hits on sites with a single probe or with 3 probes, but even then, it didn’t mean a warpable hit. 100% strength just means that you have no deviation at all. Signal strength of 100% and a hit with 4 probes are the two elements you need to warp. One or the other will not result in you getting a warpin. And even if you disagree with this point (which neither of us can now prove), if you try it under the current system, you’ll see it’s moot, as you simply can not reach 100% signal strength with less than 4 probes

  • http://handsoff.myloots.com/ Cyberin

    Well fine…I’ll have to try it now :p

    All I know is i’ve recently (few months maybe) gotten lucky at least once and got a ship hit with 1 probe (really…i placed the thing right next to the guy in his mission)…

    Once i get my sec up I’ll play with it :)

  • http://handsoff.myloots.com Cyberin

    Well fine…I’ll have to try it now :p

    All I know is i’ve recently (few months maybe) gotten lucky at least once and got a ship hit with 1 probe (really…i placed the thing right next to the guy in his mission)…

    Once i get my sec up I’ll play with it :)